Dr. Anna Bull is a Senior Lecturer in Education and Social Justice and Co-director of The 1752 Group. We return to Zoom to speak with her about class and socioeconomic issues in the classical music industry, and pick her brains about what, if anything, can be done. She also tells us about her work on sexual harassment in music conservatoires, and why the master-apprentice model has created a particularly risky environment.Anna is speaking at the Class Ceiling conference on 9th December 2025. Free and discounted tickets are available.Read more of Anna's work:Bull, A., & Prince, K. (2025). Addressing harassment and sexual misconduct experienced by postgraduate researchers. The 1752 Group.https://1752group.wordpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2025/06/harassment_pgrs.pdfRead an interview about the toolkit for addressing harassment and sexual misconduct among postgraduate researchers, and read Anna's comment piece in Nature about the toolkit.Bull, Anna. 2025. ‘Gender Inequalities in UK Music Higher Education: The Role of Institutional Stratification’. British Journal of Sociology of Education. https://doi.org/10.1080/01425692.2025.2502802.Bull, A., & Bradley, A. (2025). Losing Confidence and Networks as an Impact of Staff/Faculty-Student Sexual Harassment: Quantitative Findings From the UK. Journal of Interpersonal Violence. https://doi.org/10.1177/08862605251322814 -------------------------------------------------------------Things Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdta Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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104. The Break Down: Depression, donors and misogyny
Trigger Warning: suicidal ideation from 13:50 to 18:00Is it ethical that musicians feels 'owned' or controlled by their donors? Today in The Break Down, we are discussing philanthropy in classical music and opera, Hattie's recent experience of depression and the strife of misogyny, sadly still in some of Rebecca's orchestral experiencesWatch this episode on Youtube here.-------------------------------------------------------------Thank you to ABRSM for sponsoring this episode. Explore the drum kit exams and syllabus here-------------------------------------------------------------Things Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/v9jgf-things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca ToalEditor: Hattie ButterworthMusic: Katy Ehrlich Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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103. The Break Down: Saudi Arabia, Hopelessness & Activism
Welcome to our rebranded 'chatty episodes' - now, with middling irony and an exaggerated sense of self-awareness, called The Break Down.Hattie brings our Classical Strife newsletter segment to the podcast, we chat about The Met x Saudi Arabia's hot new #collab, we dis/agree on activism, and come to the usual conclusion that mental health is difficult.Like, subscribe, review (if it's nice), and share with both friends and enemies.Watch this episode on Youtube here.-------------------------------------------------------------A big thank you to our sponsors for this episode, ABRSM. Check out their new woodwind syllabus here.-------------------------------------------------------------Things Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/v9jgf-things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca ToalEditor: Rebecca ToalMusic: Katy Ehrlich Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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102. Ophelia Gordon: living though anorexia and divorce
Words hold huge power, and for a long time the word 'anorexia' felt dirty to pianist Ophelia Gordon. First experiencing its wrath while studying at the BRIT School and watching her parents' divorce unravel her life, anorexia would return two years ago when Ophelia separated from her husband. She joins Hattie and Rebecca to uncover the story of her eating disorder, the trauma of divorce and the ways in which learning and recording Nikolai Kapustin's music has saved her life.Things Musicians Don't Talk About is supported by the Royal Society of Musicians! Follow RSM on Instagram, X and Facebook.-------------------------------------------------------------Support TMDTAWant to support us on a regular basis? Consider joining our Patreon from £1 a month: https://www.patreon.com/tmdtaFeeling generous? Help us raise funds for the podcast: https://www.gofundme.com/f/v9jgf-things-musicians-dont-talk-aboutFind TMDTA on all the socials at @tmdtapodcast-------------------------------------------------------------Hosts: Hattie Butterworth & Rebecca ToalEditor: Hattie ButterworthMusic: Katy Ehrlich Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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101. Jessica Curry: when things fall apart
'If it could have gone wrong it has gone wrong'. The last five years for Jessica Curry, a composer of contemporary classical game music, has been marked by severe illness and personal loss. She joins Hattie and Becca on Things Musicians Don't Talk About to share her journey being diagnosed with ankylosing spondylitis and subsequently shielding during the pandemic. She explains the emotional toll of isolation, the importance of community and support, noting the industry's lack of empathy and her efforts to promote inclusivity. Jessica's latest album, born out of the adversity of this time, Shielding Songs, is an album of her choral music recorded with the London Voices, which is out now on Bandcamp. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Hattie Butterworth and Rebecca Toal host a podcast of insight and change in the classical music and arts professions. Delving into the often stigmatised worlds of mental health, injury, discrimination and productivity, classical music issues are spoken and revived. Join Hattie, Rebecca and guests for important conversations, inspiring moments of wisdom and poignant vulnerability. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Netherlands