Episode 226: Why Every Product Team Needs a Playtesting Mindset with Christina Wodtke
In this episode, I sit down with Christina Wodtke, a professor at Stanford University, for the second time on the show, to explore the intersection of game design and product management. Christina shares her insights on how principles from game design can transform product development processes, making them more engaging and effective. We also dive into the role of AI in shaping the future of product management education and the unique challenges and opportunities it presents.Christina discusses her approach to integrating AI into her curriculum and how it's helping future product leaders understand the real-world implications of evolving technologies. Together, we uncover the importance of balancing user experience with business objectives and how the two can coexist to create products that are not only functional but also meaningful.Don't miss this insightful conversation that bridges the gap between creativity and strategy in product management!You’ll hear us talk about:05:33 - The Power of Engagement in Game DesignChristina explains how game design principles such as engagement and emotional experience can be applied to product design to fulfill user needs and expectations.12:25 - Continuous Feedback IntegrationThe importance of regular and early user feedback in the design process and how it prevents teams from becoming too attached to their initial ideas.41:08 - The Reality of AI in Product ManagementDiscussing the gap between AI's potential and its current capabilities, and how product managers can effectively leverage AI while focusing on core product values.Episode resources:Christina on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/christinawodtke/Christina’s blog: https://eleganthack.com/Check our new course: https://productinstitute.com/p/mastering-product-strategy-overviewTimestamps:00:00 Introduction03:16 Dear Melissa06:35 Game design and emotional engagement13:36 Balancing goals and ethics in product design18:14 Building habits of testing and scaffolding feedback22:30 How AI is changing prototyping and team dynamics28:53 The role of expertise in an AI-powered world40:15 Getting into product management in the age of AI
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Episode 225: Aligning Pricing With Product and Customer Segments with Dan Balcauski
Join me in the latest episode of the Product Thinking Podcast as I welcome Dan Balcauski, founder of Product Tranquility.Dan is an expert in optimizing pricing and packaging for B2B SaaS companies. In our conversation, we discussed strategic nuances of pricing models, the importance of understanding customer value, and the common pitfalls organizations face in their pricing strategies.In this episode, Dan addresses the intricacies of pricing beyond numbers, emphasizing the need for a strategic approach that aligns with both market demands and customer needs. He shares insights on how effective pricing can transform from a liability into a formidable competitive advantage, thanks to segmentation, value-based pricing, and strategic decision-making.If you’re looking to refine your pricing strategy and leverage it as a competitive edge, tune in for actionable insights and expert advice.You’ll hear us talk about:06:38 - The Journey to Pricing ExpertiseDan shares his transition from software engineering into the pricing world. He highlights that companies often neglect how they capture value, resulting in rushed pricing decisions despite the significant impact pricing can have on a company’s success.15:03 - The Mechanics of Pricing and PackagingExplore the four elements critical to pricing in B2B SaaS: price metric, price model, offer configurations, and price fences. Dan uses the McDonald's menu as a relatable example to illustrate how these elements play out in the real world.39:18 - Lessons for Long-Term Pricing SuccessDan advises treating pricing as a process that evolves with market changes, noting the importance of governance, continuous improvement, and alignment with customer value and business strategy.Episode resources:Dan on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/balcauski/Product Tranquility: https://www.producttranquility.com/Check our new course: https://productinstitute.com/p/mastering-product-strategy-overviewTimestamps:00:00 Coming Up07:47 Pricing Misconceptions and Segmentation15:03 Pricing Mechanics and Internal Ownership23:50 Scaling Pricing Metrics and AI-Related Challenges34:45 Avoiding Bad Pricing Metrics39:18 Advice for Long-Term Pricing Success
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Episode 224: Why Empathy Is a Product Superpower with Somer Simpson
In this episode, Somer Simpson, VP of Product at Customer.io, joins us to discuss the role of empathy in product management. With a wealth of experience in online media and startups, Somer shares how product managers can drive innovation by cultivating empathy for customers and themselves.She explores how you can have a human-centered approach when crafting products and how self-reflection grows empathy for customers. Somer also highlights the balance between using AI to close knowledge gaps and maintaining a human touch to truly understand user needs.Are you ready to discover how empathy can improve your product strategy and execution? Don't miss this conversation that offers wisdom for product managers at every career stage.You’ll hear us talk about:13:00 - Embracing Chaos in Product ManagementSomer discusses the need to be comfortable with chaos as a product manager. Like whitewater rafting, being a PM is about leaning into chaos rather than resisting it. This helps managers better discern patterns and innovate effectively.16:30 - Developing True EmpathySomer explains that empathy goes beyond the simple observation or acknowledgment of customer pain. It involves accepting others' perspectives as valid. She relates this concept to personal growth, suggesting that self-acceptance is crucial for developing authentic empathy37:49 - Human Touch in InnovationSomer believes that humans play an irreplaceable role in innovation, despite advancements in AI. While AI can increase efficiency, it's the human understanding and care for customer problems that truly drive product success.Episode resources:Somer on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/somersimpson/Customer.io website: https://customer.io/Check our new course: https://productinstitute.com/p/mastering-product-strategy-overviewTimestamps:00:00 Introduction02:50 Dear Melissa16:30 Empathy starts with yourself22:29 Curiosity, failure, and building customer love28:47 Meaningful discovery and avoiding chaos33:28 AI can't replace empathy
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Episode 223: Behind the Rise of GitHub Copilot with Mario Rodriguez
Join us for an engaging episode of the Product Thinking Podcast as I speak with Mario Rodriguez, Chief Product Officer at GitHub, about the transformative role of AI in product management and development.In this episode, Mario discusses the integration of AI into GitHub's strategy, particularly through GitHub Copilot, and how it leverages AI to improve creativity in software development.Mario provides a deep dive into how GitHub Copilot is changing the developer's landscape by freeing them from mundane tasks and allowing them to focus more on creative problem-solving. He also shares his vision for the future of software development and the role AI will play in it.Listen in to learn how AI can be a powerful tool to amplify productivity and creativity in your product management strategy.You'll hear us talk about:08:22 - Reimagining Developer ToolsMario talks about how GitHub Copilot started as an AI-native product, focusing on augmenting human creativity rather than replacing it, and how it strategically integrates with existing developer workflows.24:12 - Surprises in Copilot AdoptionDiscover the unexpected ways developers used GitHub Copilot and how it challenged initial assumptions about product acceptance and success in the market.32:27 - The Future of Product Management with AIExplore how AI is shaping the product management field and what it means for the role of product managers in this fast-evolving industry.Episode resources:Mario on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mariorodriguez3/Github Copilot: https://github.com/features/copilotCheck our new course: https://productinstitute.com/p/mastering-product-strategy-overviewTimestamps:00:00 Introduction02:45 Dear Melissa04:52 From Microsoft to GitHub CPO13:13 Failing toward the right UX for Copilot16:23 Using evals and metrics to refine AI models24:03 Seeing Copilot in the wild: surprises and adoption29:16 AI’s role in augmenting vs. replacing developers36:26 Embedding AI into product strategy and practice
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Episode 222: Designing for Real User Understanding with Dheerja Kaur
Dheerja Kaur, Vice President of Product Management at Robinhood, joins Melissa Perri on the Product Thinking Podcast to discuss her journey from engineering to product leadership. Her experience integrating design and user experience into product development at Robinhood has fostered a culture of ambitious thinking and learning by doing.Dheerja shares insights into balancing experimentation with strategic objectives and emphasizes the importance of empowering product teams to think big while aligning with organizational vision. Would you like to empower your product teams to think ambitiously while staying aligned with business goals? Don't miss out on Dheerja's insights.You’ll hear us talk about:07:34 - Defining the Product Manager RoleDheerja reflects on her transition from software engineering to product management at ESPN and how she navigated the shift from a technical role to a strategic one.13:01 - Coaching without MicromanagingDheerja shares strategies on finding the balance between providing guidance to new PMs and allowing them the autonomy to grow, fostering a supportive learning environment.28:09 - Balancing Experimentation with Ambitious GoalsDheerja discusses how to encourage teams to think big and have a portfolio of bets to achieve ambitious objectives while maintaining a culture of learning and experimentation.Episode resources:Dheerja on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dheerja/Robinhood website: https://robinhood.com/Check our new course: https://productinstitute.com/p/mastering-product-strategy-overviewTimestamps:00:00 Coming Up00:56 Intro06:29 Dheerja’s journey into product13:01 Coaching PMs without micromanaging17:53 Learning Design22:16 UX In Finance28:09 Balancing experimentation with ambitious goals33:32 Proving the business value of great design38:43 Embracing risk
Successful product management isn’t just about training the product managers who work side by side with developers everyday to build better products. It’s about taking a step back, approaching the systems within organizations as a whole, and leveling up product leadership to improve these systems. This is the Product Thinking Podcast, where Melissa Perri will connect with industry leading experts in the product management space, AND answer your most pressing questions about everything product. Join us each week to level up your skillset and invest in yourself as a product leader.
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